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 이름:heyou (hwanforeva@hanmail.net)
2003/12/17(수) 19:26 (MSIE6.0,WindowsNT5.1) 219.241.189.108 1024x768
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 바라씨가 제시한 논문
바라씨 난 당신의 의견을 최대한으로 존중하고 당신이 제시한 논문을 읽었습니다. 그런데 당신이 제시한 논문 어디에도 당신이말한것처럼 비타민시가 CD4 수치를 객관적으로 올리는데 기여한다는 말은없습니다. 그리고 오히려 이 논문들에서 비중있게 다뤄지는것은 비타민 A이며 그것또한 CD4수치 상승보다는 수직감염의 예방에 효과가 있다고 합니다.
그리고 영양결핍이 면역력을 떨어뜨리는것은 누구나 다 아는사실입니다.
여기에 내가 해석해놓은 것들을 읽어보고 도대체 당신이 무슨근거로 어제와같은 주장을 펼쳤는지 확실히 반박해야할 것이오.
1.
SCIENTIFIC DATA AGAINST THE USE OF NEVIRAPINE
By Roberto Giraldo
Oct. 2001
특히, 4. Alternative non-toxic measures to prevent MTCT.
(AIDS와 CD4 처치에 대한 비타민 요법 설명)
답변 : 지금부터 당신이 당신글의 근거로 제시한 논문을 확실하게 설명해볼테니 반박해보시오. 정확하게 내가말한게 왜 틀렸는지 내 말 한마디 한마디에 확실히 반박해주시기 바랍니다. 늘 그렇듯이 다른방향으로 말을돌리며 쓸데없는 또다른 논문 들먹거리지말고.
4. Alternative non-toxic measures to prevent MTCT.
The Department of Health of the Republic of South Africa is aware of alternative non-toxic means to avoid what is known as "MTCT of HIV", means which will be tested and compared to Nevirapine during the projected protocol (Ministry of Health 2001).
Scientific studies support the contention that the use of vitamins by themselves could be enough to avoid what is known as mother to child transmission of HIV (Stiehm 1995; Landers 1995; Fawzi & Hunter 1998). If this is the case, as many clinical trials and scientific papers contend, it would constitute a very inexpensive and non-toxic practice for South Africa and other countries.
--> 여기서 말하는것은 비타민의 사용이 그 자체로 어머니에서 아이로의 HIV 수직감염을 충분히 막아줄 수 있다는 주장을 과학적인 실험들이 "뒷받침"해준다는 말입니다.
Regarding vitamins in HIV disease progression and vertical transmission, researchers from the Harvard School of Public Health state: "The higher rates of HIV progression and vertical transmission in developing countries coincide with similarly higher rates of malnutrition and vitamin deficiencies, indicating that HIV infection, may be modified by nutritional status." "Numerous observational studies report inverse association between vitamin status, measured bio-chemically or as levels of dietary intake, and the risk of disease progression or vertical transmission." "Adequate vitamin status may also reduce vertical transmission through the intra-partum and breastfeeding routes by reducing HIV viral load in lower genital secretions and breast milk" and "Vitamin supplements MAY be one of the few potential treatments that are inexpensive enough to be made available to HIV-infected persons in developing countries" (Fawzi & Hunter 1998).
--> 여기서 말하는것 또한 단지 비타민공급이 아마도 어머니에서 자식으로의 수직감염을 막아줄 수 있을것이라는말입니다. 여기서 주의할 것은 분명히 ABSOLUTELY 라는식의 확고한 표현이아니라 아마도 그럴 수 있을것이라는 MAY 라는 표현으로 단지 추측하고 있다는 것입니다.
"A growing body of data suggests that low serum levels of vitamin A among HIV-infected pregnant women is associated with higher risk of vertical transmission of HIV" (Fawzi & Hunter 1998).
"Mean vitamin A concentration in 74 mothers who transmitted HIV to their infants was lower than that in 264 mothers who did not transmit HIV to their infants" (Semba et al 1994a).
"In Malawi, higher serum retinol of HIV-infected pregnant women was associated with a reduced risk of vertical transmission" (Semba et al 1994a; Fawzi & Hunter 1998).
" Women who had increasing serum retinol levels over time, however were at a lower risk, whereas women who had declining serum retinol were at a higher risk of transmitting the virus" (Landesman 1996; Fawzi & Hunter 1998).
"Vitamin A supplementation to a population of HIV-infected pregnant women, many of whom had low vitamin A levels, was associated with a decreased number of preterm births and with reduced mother-to-child transmission of HIV in preterm babies, but was not associated with a reduction in HIV transmission overall. Vitamin A decreased HIV transmission in the preterm babies by 47%" (Coutsoudis et al 1999).
"Detection of vaginal HIV-1 DNA was associated with abnormal vaginal discharge, lower absolute CD4 cell count, and severe vitamin A deficiency" (John et al 1997).
"Women with CD4 cell depletion, especially those with vitamin A deficiency, may be at increased risk of transmitting HIV-1 to their infants through breast milk" (Nduati et al 1995).
"Increased risk of maternal-infant transmission was associated with severe vitamin A deficiency among non-breastfeeding women" in the United States (Greenberg et al 1997).
Something to keep in mind is that vitamin A could be teratogenic and WHO recommends that pregnant women should not take more than 10,000 IU of Vitamin A per day (Shah et al 1987; Fawzi & Hunter 1998).
--> 이 단락또한 수직감염을 말하는데 중요한것은 RETINOL 다시말해 VITAMIN A 의 결핍시 수직감염의 빈도가 높다고 말합니다. 즉 수직감염을 줄일 수도 있을것이라는 그 비타민은 A 입니다!!
당신은 특히 4. AIDS와 CD4 처치에 대한 비타민 요법 설명 이라며 읽어보라 했는데 비타민 요법이라니 무슨 비타민 요법이 이 글에 있습니까?
단지 비타민 등 영양섭취를 잘 하라는것이지 당신말처럼 거창하게 요법이라느니하는 단어를 붙일만한 내용의 글이 아니군요.
바라씨 난 이로 미루어볼때 결코 당신이 이 논문을 꼼꼼히 읽었다고 생각지 않습니다. 해석가능한 몇줄만읽고 내용을 다 추측해버린듯한 인상을 받게되네요.
5.1. Good nutrition as a mean to prevent AIDS.
An optimal nutritional status as well as adequate vitamin levels is known to be by themselves enough to prevent AIDS in people who react positively on the tests for HIV. Let us examine some scientific facts:
"All persons with HIV infection should be screened for nutritional problems and concerns at the time of their first contact with a health care professional, and routine monitoring should be performed on an ongoing basis" (Mahan & Escott -Stump 2000).
"The risk of death among HIV-infected subjects with adequate serum vitamin A levels was 78% less, when compared with Vitamin A-deficient subjects" (Semba et al 1994a,b; Fawzi & Hunter 1998).
"In a study carried out among HIV-positive homosexual men, development of Vitamin A deficiency over an 18-month period was associated with a decline in CD4 cell count, widely used as a marker of HIV immune impairment. Normalization of vitamin A was associated with higher CD4 cell counts" (Baum et al 1995; Fawzi & Hunter 1998).
"Lower serum levels of vitamin A were associated with a faster rate of progression among men who participated in the Multicenter AIDS Cohort Study (MACS)" (Tang et al 1997; Fawzi & Hunter 1998).
"Among well nourished HIV- seropositive men who participated in the San Francisco Men’s Health Study, high energy-adjusted vitamin A intake at baseline was associated with higher CD4 cell count at baseline, as well as with lower risk of developing AIDS during the 6 years period follow up" (Abrams et al 1993; Fawzi & Hunter 1998).
"In a placebo-controlled trial in South Africa among children born to HIV-positive women, Vitamin A supplements resulted in approximately 50% reduction in diarrheal morbidity among HIV-infected children" (Coutsoudis et al 1995; Fawzi & Hunter 1998).
In Tanzania: "Multivitamin supplementation is a low-cost way of substantially decreasing adverse pregnancy outcomes and increasing T-cell counts in HIV-1 infected women" (Fawzi et al 1998).
--> 여기서는 충분한 영양은 HIV 양성반응을 보이는 사람들의 에이즈로의 발병을 막아준다는 것입니다.그리고 CD4의 숫자에 관련이 잇다는것입니다. 주의할것은 분명히 여기서도 VITAMIN A 가 이같은 작용을 한다는것입니다.
5.2. Nutritional therapy as mean to treat AIDS.
"Recent studies have begun to identify the vitamin and mineral needs of HIV-positive persons and those with AIDS. These studies suggest the need for increased intake of the following micronutrients: beta-carotene, vitamin E, ascorbic acid, vitamin B12, vitamin B6, and folic acid (Prabhala et al 1990; Raiten 1990; Coodley et al 1993; Mahan & Escott -Stump 2000).
--> 첫째줄에 분명히 최근의 연구들이 비타민과 미네랄의 에이즈와의 관계가 명확해지기 시작했다고 합니다. 명확해지기 시작했다는것이기 확실하게 밝혀졌다고 한것이 아닙니다.
그러고서는 더 많이 섭취할것을 관유한데서 분명 ascorbic acid( 비타민 c 의 정식학명) 의 존재를 확인할 수 있습니다. 이것이 유일하게 바라씨가 말하는 비타민씨가 HIV 포비아들에게 좋아요~하며 광고하는데 대한 단서입니다. 하지만 읽어보면 알겠지만 비타민 B6도 그렇고 엽산도 그렇고 심지어 비타민 E까지 같이 거론되어있습니다.
Regarding AIDS in children, scientists state: "In addition to supporting optimal function of the immune system, nutrition is especially critical in children, as it provides the best opportunity for normal growth and development" (Heler 1997; Mahan & Escott -Stump 2000).
--> 그리고 여기서 중요한것은 분명 영양결핍은 어린이들에게 흔한것이라고 합니다. 따라서 충분한 영양을 서포트 해주는것은 어린이들의 면역을 유지해주고 정상적으로 자라는데 좋다는것입니다. 다시말해 비타민등의 영양요법은 특히나 어린이들에게 좋다는말이죠.
Since the early 1980’s, since the beginning of the AIDS epidemic, researchers have provided scientific facts which support the belief that AIDS can be treated and overcome by guaranteeing an optimal nutritional status to the immune and other systems of the person suffering the syndrome. However, it seams that the propaganda spread by pharmaceutical companies to commercialize their toxic antiretroviral medications has prevented these ideas from being widely accepted. The following are just some of the scientific papers and books that review the issue of nutritional therapy for the treatment of AIDS: Collins 1988; Life Sciences 1990; Raiten 1990; Keusch & Farthing 1990; Keusch & Thea 1993; American Dietetic Association 1994, 1998; Bristol-Myers 1994; Romeyn 1995; Bahl & Hickson 1995; Steinbrook 1997; Young 1997; Beise 2000; Mahan & Escott -Stump 2000; Watson 2001; Gerrior & Wanke 2001.
--> 이 문단에서 주의할것은 분명히 에이즈가 영양공급으로 TREAT될 수 있다는것을 "믿음"이라고 표현하고 있습니다. 다시말해 확실한 TRUTH 가 아니라는것이죠. 그리고 내용은 제약회사가 이같은 믿음이 널리 퍼진ㄴ것을 막고있다는 겁니다.
It is important to recommend to the members of the Treatment Action Campaign of South Africa, the Government of Uganda, as well as to any other organization, institution or government, that they carefully study this information instead of promoting toxic antiretroviral medications that without doubt contribute to the collapse of the immune system and may in fact cause AIDS. This is the only way to avoid what happened during the Second World War when Jewish people, with the best of intentions, helped to place their brothers and sisters onto trains going to concentration camps, because they erroneously thought that they were sending them to a better land.
--> 여기서는 이같은 영양요법을 자세히 연구해라는 말입니다. 무턱대고 제약회사의 약을 의심없이 복용하지 말고 영양요법을 공부하는것이 더 낫다는 말입니다.
2.
LOW CD4+ T LYMPHOCYTE COUNTS
By Matt Irwin
Feb. 2001
특히, 7) Low CD4 counts in malnutrition
답변 : 당신은 이 논문 제대 로 읽기나 했습니까? 여기서 말하는건 단지 CD4의 면역학적 의미, 다시말해 CD4 의 COUNTING 이 어떤 의미를 가지며, 영양부족이 이 CD4 COUNTING 에 어떤 영향을 끼치는지등을 말했습니다. 주를 이루는건 CD4+ COUNT 에 관한것이지 당신이 말한것처럼 영양부족과 CD4수치에 대해서 다룬 논문이 아니라는것입니다.
"Infections, no matter how mild, have adverse effects on nutritional status. The significance of these effects depends on the previous nutritional status of the individual, the nature and duration of the infection, and the diet during the recovery period [all of these factors are often adversely affected in people diagnosed HIV-positive]. Conversely, almost any nutrient deficiency, if sufficiently severe, will impair resistance to infection." (Scrimshaw & SanGiovanni 1997)
Based on the articles examined above, it could easily be argued that food, social support, and financial independence are solutions that should be given a much higher priority when offering aid to poorer nations. They also suggest that food, financial independence, and social support should be a much higher priority for HIV and AIDS programs in wealthy nations, as well.
--> 별 내용없습니다 . 영양공급을 잘 해주는것이 HIV와 AIDS 관련 연구계획에 무엇보다 선행되야할것을 제시한다는것입니다.
결론 : 다시한번 묻습니다. 도대체 어디에 당신이 말한 근거가 있는지 나처럼 한줄씩 그 근거가 되는 부분을 해석해 주시바랍니다.그리고 위의 논문에대한 내 해석이 틀렸다면 가차없이 반박해주시오.
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